(ICNW) As one of the UK’s leading jazz writers and critics, when did you first become aware of Ian Carr and what attracted you to his music?
(AS) I first heard Ian in person in 1969, playing with Mike Garrick's sextet. I was 16, and already interested in traditional and mainstream jazz, but this was my first introduction to the live sound of contemporary British Jazz. Mike, Don Rendell, Art Themen, Coleridge Goode and John Marshall all made an impression on me, but it was Ian's playing that stood out.
(ICNW) Do you see Ian as more of a virtuoso performer or an innovator?
(AS) More of an innovator, given his work at the forefront of so many genres, although he's certainly produced some great virtuoso solos, from I'm Beginning to See The Light on Stan Tracey's Love You Madly album through to things like Kaleidoscope of Rainbows, where he is exceptional throughout, and individual solos like Snakehips' Dream on the Nucleus at the BBC sessions.
(ICNW) Have you been influenced or impressed by Ian’s writing in any way (ie, the Miles, Keith Jarrett and Music Outside books?)
(AS) Music Outside was a book I learned a lot from when it first appeared, I have found the Miles book extremely useful as a guide to my own researches and thinking about Miles, and as a jumping off point for many BBC programmes. I actually came to the Jarrett book quite late, well after I'd started interviewing and writing about Keith myself, so that had less of an impact on me and my work, but the other two have both been essential reading.
(ICNW) Do you sense any bitterness that Ian lost several musicians from the original Nucleus line-up, many of whom were absorbed by Soft Machine, or do you think he accepted this stoically and moved on?
(AS) I think I'd be right in saying that most of the bitterness and bad feeling that occurred at the time is now long gone. For example, John Marshall returned to the Nucleus fold, but still plays in various Softs tributes and reunions, and Ian and Pete King at Ronnie's made it up with Ian years ago during the George Russell band residency at the club. Karl is now into a very different area of music, and I don't think his path and Ian's have crossed since the split.
(ICNW) Did you find Ian an easy or difficult subject for a biography?
(AS) Easy because we have a lot in common. Difficult, because I've known him for a long time. I've had no problems in getting to grips with Ian's background, because my grandmother grew up near to where Ian and Mike were children, and our respective great grandfathers were both part of the Durham establishment in the 19th century. We share musical tastes, have much listening in common, and have, indeed, played with some of the same musicians over the years. So being objective is harder under these circumstances, but I hope I've managed that.
(ICNW) Do you sense a distinct feel to British jazz as opposed to jazz from America or do you perceive jazz as a universal language?
(AS) Defining jazz is one of those "how long is a piece of string?" questions, and I spent a lot of time in my New History of Jazz arguing that - on the Dr Johnson principle of a dictionary recording rather than prescribing usage - a definition of jazz encompasses all the types of music that have been known as jazz, each of which has a different accent within a common language. So in considering the musical language of Ian, I've viewed it in terms of a particularly British dialect of jazz, albeit one that draws from Ian's extensive knowledge of and love for American jazz, but not forgetting his world music connections with the likes of Amancio D'Silva and Guy Warren.
(ICNW) Do you think jazz is recognised in the UK as serious music or is it still – to paraphrase Ian’s book ‘Music Outside’ - a ‘Cinderella’ art form?
(AS) I think it's recognised as a serious music, but also a minority taste. This is more or less where it sits in terms of everything from funding to radio coverage. It isn't regarded as "art" in the same way that it is by both funding bodies and broadcasters in many European countries, but equally it is no longer regarded as "popular" - even after the Jamie Cullum revolution. Actually the Cullum phenomenon rather confirms Ian's "cinderella" image. Jazz was briefly hailed as the new thing, and everything from Sunday supplements to teenage magazines were full of Jamie, but now the footmen have turned back to mice, the glass slipper has gone missing, and we're on to the next fashion of the moment....
(ICNW) On a more general note, what first attracted you to jazz?
(AS) My father came back from the far east with a pile of 78s he'd collected in Hong Kong immediately after the war, of everything from Earl Hines and Fats Waller to Duke Ellington and Muggsy Spanier, so this was the music I listened to as a child, along with the classics. I wanted to play it from the moment I could sit at a piano!
(ICNW) I see from the picture on your website that you play bass, how long have you played this instrument and why bass particularly?
(AS) I've played bass since the 1960s, first in a school band and then at Oxford University, where I ran the jazz club. I went on to play a lot of traditional and mainstream jazz, with a long association with Sammy Rimington, and a short period in Ken Colyer's band. I played in the Vile Bodies big band at the Ritz in the 80s and early 90s, often alongside Don Rendell in the reed section.
I wanted to play bass from the age of about twelve, but I had to start out on the cello because I wasn't big enough to reach the fingering positions on the bass! Then I got a half-size instrument, and started playing seriously at about the age of fourteen. Now I split my time between playing classical orchestral bass in and around Oxford, and getting back together with my mainstream jazz friends for festival gigs.
(ICNW) Apart from Ian Carr, who would you rate as your favourite jazz musician(s) – alive or dead?
(AS) Mainly the other ones I've written about: Fats Waller, Bud Powell, and Dizzy Gillespie. Then there's Louis, Mingus and Duke of course. But to that list I'd add Ornette Coleman, Oscar Peterson and Keith Jarrett, all of whom are still with us!
(ICNW) Do you have an all-time top three jazz albums?
(AS) Difficult question, but I think they'd have to include: Satchmo at Symphony Hall, Ellington at Newport 56 (the amazing digitally cleaned up stereo version), and Mingus Ah Um.
(ICNW) When do you expect the Ian Carr biography ‘Out of the Long Dark’ to be published and will it be available from the usual retail outlets?
(AS) We're hoping for June 22 [2006] as publication day. All Equinox books are obtainable via Amazon or Jazzscript UK websites, and ought to be found in bookshops with any kind of decent music collection (Blackwell Music Shop, Hatchard's Piccadilly, Waterstone's Gower St etc).
(ICNW) Thank you very much Alyn.
Interview date: 13 April 2006
Equinox website